Clay: Hello and welcome to the Online Counselling Podcast. I’m Clay Cockrell. Thank you for joining us for what is a rainy day here in New York. I’m hoping that the ambient sounds of Manhattan and the jackhammer and everything is a little reduced today, but we’ll have to see. You never know. If you are new to the podcast, here’s my little caveat. I’m located in Midtown Manhattan near Central Park and right across the street from the Mandarin Oriental Hotel, which, I’m told, is one of the premiere hotels in the world, very fancy. I’ve not been in it but through the window, it looks very fancy.
It’s kind of cool because I can look out my window and watch all the celebrities come and go, crowds gather around and scream for Taylor Swift, Lady Gaga, or whoever is visiting town that day. The president coming to town really shuts the area down, which is fine. It’s just part of living in this incredible city, but what is so annoying especially for a podcaster is the whistle. The doorman or bellhop, I guess he is called, when there is a guest that needs a taxi, he steps out and blows on this incredibly loud whistle to summon the taxis that are on Broadway. He goes to town on this thing.
Over the years, I’ve become deaf to it, but you’re going to probably hear him. Actually, I heard from a listener who said she listens to the podcast in the car with her kids as they go to school, I guess, in the morning and they crack up laughing each time the little whistle goes off. That’s just funny. If that guy only knew, he’s becoming a podcast star. Anyway, there’s that.
On to today’s podcast, which is really exciting. Today, we get to talk with Geoff Simons of the Private Practice Hub in the UK. He is the one and only, the leading voice in the UK who helps private practice practitioners approach their business in a professional way, to learn how to run a business as a private practitioner. If you need information on starting or growing your private practice for therapy or for life coaching, he is your one stop. He has it all – guidance for marketing, financing, fee collections, legal setup, electronic records. He will help you find a room to do therapy in.
He’s been doing it for years and is an amazing resource for therapists. He has the Private Practice Hub, the coaching hub for life coaches and today, he makes a huge announcement about his new project, the Online Therapy Hub, where he is collaborating with previous podcast guest, Philippa Weitz, Kate Dunn, Carole Francis-Smith, who we’re hoping to have on the private practice soon. There is all sorts of great information there for all of the particulars of doing online counseling in the UK.
They have a great blog. They even do reviews of different platforms that are encrypted like Zoom, VSee, iCam, which is a new one to me, just lots of information. Geoff is a great guy and has a really cool story of how he got started in all of this. It’s an honor to have someone of his caliber on the show and I hope you like him.
Hello and welcome to the Online Counselling Podcast. I am extremely excited to have as our guest today Geoff Simons of the Private Practice Hub in the UK. Geoff, thank you so much for joining us.
Geoff: It’s an absolute pressure. I’ve enjoyed our previous conversations and I just can’t wait to have this chat with you with our audience.
Clay: I am so excited to get to know you. I’ve learned a little bit about you in our previous call and I think the story of how you came to this is fascinating and maybe just kind of truncated version of how you became involved with helping therapists in the UK counselors build their practices and advice them. What’s a little history on that?
Geoff: Sure. What I’ll try and do is give you the shortened version. It starts back with my wife who is a clinical psychologist and she was in the NHS, National Health Service, over here for a goodly period of time, but as probably even you guys over there know that the National Health Service is not that great and certainly one of the things that Katrina didn’t like was waiting lists. She eventually left the Health Service back in 2008 and started in private practice. Within, seriously, three months of her doing her private practice, she started, hey, guess what, having a waiting list.
That wasn’t going to work for her, so at that time, she had a number of colleagues, ex-colleagues, friends, people that she could trust that she could start outsourcing the referrals to the third parties, and started building up a business. We now have, today, we’re based in Southwest England, Bristol & Bath, and we have 39 associates currently working. It’s a fairly large practice by most people’s standards as most, 80% of therapists in the UK are individuals, 20% working for clinics, etc., and obviously, we still do have a small NHS service.
I’m only referring to private practice in this conversation. We started straight away day one using, probably because of my background being in the IT and software, we started with a practice management software. In 2009 after using it for a year, we suggested to them because looking around at the marketplace in those days and even today, most of the therapy practice management softwares were based around our chiro practice, osteos, and physical practitioners.
We went to the software houses just to them that they actually wrote a package for talking therapists. After getting a few strange looks and me creating a business plan, they agreed actually to go ahead. Part of my marketing plan that I gave them, I suggested that in order to sell this, you need to do it cheaply, you need to do sell in large numbers, and that wasn’t about knocking on doors and saying, “Hello. I’ve got this piece of software.” You need to do it by using referral marketing mechanisms such as Private Practice Hub.
After they signed the agreement, I went off and we started writing Private Practice Hub and writing all about the business information that therapists need to know about starting a business. I’m writing away and we finalize our things, and I’m still waiting for the software to be delivered. I’m waiting and I’m waiting, and said, “Oh, we can’t keep this information from the audience. I need to launch.” We decided to launch and eventually, 18 months later than the agreed date, they finally produced a package, but by that time, Private Practice Hub had gone off on its own merits. People couldn’t believe the information that we’ve been putting up because in the UK, there are about 234 associations in this market place of therapy.
Clay: That’s fascinating to me. There are 234 associations of therapists.
Geoff: Yes.
Clay: That just fascinates me but I wanted to put an underline on that.
Geoff: people are starting and people thinking, “Oh, this is a good idea. We’ll start an association because that’s a good way of generating income for people. That’s another story.
Clay: Alright.
Geoff: So there are 234 associations and none of them, none of them talk about business. None of them actually help the therapist, their members actually earning income. It’s all about how to actually do the CPD, how to do training, how much money they can spend with the association, how much money in training, etc., not about how you actually earn the money to pay for this trade they got, etc. We do have a niche in the marketplace and it’s the moment in the UK I’m still the only one that actually has this business information. I do believe there’s possibly three that you could recognize in the states as having some kind of portal that give you business information, but in the UK, I’m the only one.
Clay: You are the only private practice consultant teaching therapists and counselors business and how to grow your practice in the entire of the UK?
Geoff: That is my belief, yes. I researched and I can’t find. I would say there are more than two or three, there are a number of trainers that will train people, but there are gainers are handful of those people that have that sort of support in terms of advising people the best way to move forward. I still get lots of questions about is there anybody that can help me run this business? I had one today that wanted me to go out and do some consultancy with them and I’m trying not to do that. I’m trying to keep my focus because as you know, I’ve got a number of things coming in the near future that I’m trying to keep on track because that’s my excitement is actually giving new things to the audience.
Clay: That’s the great thing, I think, about your story and so many business people is they see a need in the marketplace and yours was working with your wife as she went out and began a very successful private practice that there was a need for not just software management but education on how to run a business. We talk about here in the States all the time that we go to school, we go to graduate school and we learn how to be very good therapists, but we don’t learn how to hang a shingle out, do a website, do the finance, the legal structure to grow a business. We’re not business people and yet, we are running businesses. That’s how Private Practice Hub came to be.
Geoff: Indeed. Interestingly, sorry, I was picking up one word that you used there, shingle. It’s not a word that’s used in the UK. I have to say, my wife being 10 years in New York still has some Americanisms that she comes out with. It’s still the sidewalk here. It’s still the trash. It’s still the shingle. It’s still the stroller. It still comes out from time to time. She can’t get rid of those.
Clay: Absolutely. Its’ fascinating. We’re so similar and yet there are things, the elevator versus the lift, I think, is one.
Geoff: Absolutely.
Clay: Back to Private Practice. I was surfing the site before we got on the call today. You have advice on marketing, on finance, you run workshops. You have a newsletter. Tell me a little bit about some of the programs that if a UK therapist comes to Private Practice Hub that they are going to be able to participate in or learn from.
Geoff: Sure. The idea that I first came out with was put as much information on one site that would enable the therapist all the information that they need. The recent additions we’ve included in events database which has got all of the major events providers adding their events, so we become the go to place for all events. Now, I’m going to tell you something. It’s a little bit of a sneak preview, but next week, I’m launching a brand new TV channel specifically to run live events. That will be the first one for private practitioners. It will be the first one in the UK for sure. I’m not the owner of the technology. That’s run by a company called MiMi.tv, but we’re working in partnership to deliver a first rate service and as soon as I get my demo properly orchestrated which is happening next week, either on Tuesday or Wednesday, I shall send you a link so you can actually have a look at it for yourself.
Clay: Well, you’ve always struck me as somebody that’s cutting edge, but this is beyond. You’re going to have a television channel for counselors. That’s fascinating.
Geoff: Yes and not only that, but if you’re running a free event, hey, it’s free to use. There is no charge. I’m also holding that out to you guys in the States as well. There is no charge to run a free event. If you start charging for your event, per seat is, say is £20, $20, then there’s a 20% charge commission, if you like. There’s a payment platform so you don’t need to worry about the administration. Everything is done through the portal site. Not only would we have the events database where therapists can actually search for events, but will have an ongoing live event audience and it’s really exciting stuff. It’s trying to combine lots of technologies here and get everything working together for the therapist to get the best experience possible.
Clay: Incredible. Now, are these going to be recorded, a database of trainings?
Geoff: Sure. You have a live event. Every live event is recorded and therefore then, if it’s a monetized event, so you’re charging for your seat, the recordings can be charged too. People can download it but they have to pay for it first. There are opportunities to, dare I say it, monetize for the therapist for the event provider. It’s their event. Now, I’ve talked to a number of event providers and they are getting quite excited about this. The first question is, well, what’s the difference between us doing it on our website and you doing it? Well, the difference is I’ve got the technology. It’s leading edge technology. I’ve got the audience and I can generate a lot more viewers if you like and better potential.
Clay: Absolutely. Talk to me a little bit about your audience. You’ve been doing this for quite some time. Here’s an American phrase, “you’re the only game in town “and that you’ve got a lot of valuable information there. What’s the reaction from UK therapists into Private Practice Hub?
Geoff: The biggest reaction and the question that I get because I do a number of events around the country and I go to association meetings, the biggest reaction is and it’s always with a 45 degree head tilt as well is, “Why is it free? What’s the catch?” I’ve done a blog piece and a video just answering that question. I earn my money, so everything for the therapist is absolutely free and will always be free. That’s the model. I earn my money originally from affiliate marketing deals, so that’s where by, if anyone comes to my site, sees a special offer from an insurance company or from a supplier of beds or whatever it happens to be, I get a small percentage. For the insurance broker, just to put it in context, I haven’t done a translation in dollars, I do apologize, but it’s £6 for every insurance policy. The therapist wins because they get it at a very reduced price. If you like the group price, I get an incremental £6, which is about $10.
Clay: About $10 I think with the exchange rate.
Geoff: Yeah, so my math there wasn’t very go, so about $10, I get that, which is nice but three months, well actually four months ago, I decided to start offering advertiser level sponsorship, and I now have a number of advertisers and sponsors that are paying me to do a lot more work with the audience, so a lot more branding, sending out sponsored emails, etc. Fortuitously, I now can say that I have a big smile on my face when I say it that as of April, it’s the first month since launch that I didn’t have to dip onto my pocket and I was earning more money than I was paying out.
Clay: Congratulations.
Geoff: Hopefully now, we’ll see that going forward. That was a nice, healthy financial movement. I mean, it has taken a while. An answer to your question some moments ago, the audience, we’ve got, I talk to 70,000 therapists in the UK on a month by month basis and have done for a long period of time. I’ve just, interesting enough, it was an American organization that I’ve just purchased from Manhattan. I just realized, it was from Manhattan, I’ve just purchased a load of data and it’s now going to go up to – sitting down – 242,000 therapists.
Clay: Your audience is 242,000?
Geoff: Yeah, so every four years, that the incremental increase. Four years ago, I did the same task of going out, collecting data. I’ve now done it four years later. It’s now quadrupled the amount of therapists in private practice.
Clay: Incredible.
Geoff: That’s mainly because there’s a shrinkage of the NHS, so in other words, what happened back in 2009 and this is why Katrina was so adamant that we shoul be moving in this direction is that 2009, that was Lord Liard wrote a report and suggested to government that they put in a lot of money, funding, for training, which they did, which is great, then the trouble was at the same time, they took the funding to the NHS so there wasn’t any positions for these trained therapists to go into. Katrina saw this and said, “That’s not going to work.” At that point, she said, “Well, I think I’m going to have to go into private practice,” and it’s happening year by year that more and more people at the NHS are resigning for various reasons not just because they can’t get a job, but there is limited funding, there’s all sorts of issues. In the UK, it does appear – I’m cautious how I phrase this – that unless you’re seriously ill or not ill at all, you have difficulty accessing mental health services.
Clay: Now, I was speaking with someone in Scotland who puts numbers on this and you tell me if this is accurate that it could be six weeks to three months before calling and I’d like to talk to somebody about my depression, anxiety, or whatever before going into seeing someone, and that going into seeing someone might actually just be a quick intake, “and here’s some material for you to read,” and that it’s better to break your leg and you get treatment right away versus to have something wrong with your head and have a mental health issue. Is it accurate?
Geoff: Unless you’ve got schizophrenia or some kind of real mental issue, that is the case or if you’re not very well at all, yes, you’ll get a CD or some bits of paper to read.
Clay: Private practice then is growing exponentially because the need is there.
Geoff: Yes. The therapy types are increasing.
Clay: Okay.
Geoff: The types of therapy are increasing. In other words it comes back to the associations. There are all sorts of different types of therapy now. It’s not just CPD, not just CBT, EMDR, CAT therapy. We now have crystal therapy. I think I’m up now to 85 different categorizations.
Clay: Fascinating.
Geoff: And that’s cutting it down.
Clay: Right, right.
Geoff: In other words, I now can produce a list of all my therapists with that category type. When an advertiser says, “I want to talk to physical therapists,” I say, “Well actually, here’s my list of all the therapy types. You take the ones you want to talk to and I’ll tell you how many therapists that equates to and then they can send out sponsored email to that list.
Clay: With the Private Practice Hub, you’re not speaking just of therapists but you have life coaches, you have the Private Coach Hub. What’s the name of the site, The Coaching Hub?
Geoff: The Coaching Hub, yes. Interestingly, there’s a new venture relatively speaking and I now have a couple of good folk there. They actually run it for me. They are the heads if you like or whatever words you want to use, the figure heads of The Coaching Hub, and they are doing a great job. They get all the information. They get their colleagues to start adding in various articles, but what I found there was that I talked to a number of coaches and they said to me, “The Private Practice Hub is all around therapists. What about us coaches?” Now, although I would argue that whether you’re a coach, a therapist, or any kind of –ist, business is business. It doesn’t matter.
Clay: Exactly.
Geoff: But coaches wanted to be seen as slightly different, to talk to them with a slightly different voice, they are slightly more business-like than therapists. I’m not trying to decry therapist but it’s my experience, and so I decided to have the Coaching Hub.
Clay: I just want to emphasize for the listeners, and you correct me if I’m wrong, Jeff, that if you are a new private practice therapist, counselor, coach even, or someone that has been established for a while, you go to Private Practice Hub, you’ve got essentially a community because you’ve got the marketing advice, you’ve got blogs on there, you’ve got financial advice, how to set up the legal entity, etc., you’ve got ongoing newsletter with additional information, and this is something that I find really interesting. You can find a room. You do a room search around the country. You need a room to have sessions on a regular basis or maybe just on an hourly rental, you can actually put in information and find a room nearby you to have the therapy. Am I missing anything?
Geoff: Absolutely. Interesting enough, I’ve also have found that nontherapists are also interested in where the therapy rooms are as well. It’s not just the therapists, it’s actually people looking for therapy who want to know where the rooms are, and then they will do a Google search based around that as well seeing who is actually occupying it. It does work.
Clay: Incredible value there.
Geoff: I tend to forget that all the things that we’ve got on Private Practice Hub, which are really bizarre, I suppose because I’m focusing for the next thing and I should be very careful about that. I’ve given you a sneak preview of my real thing that I think is going to be unbelievably big for everybody and for you guys in the States, I would guess that a lot of you guys are doing it. Online therapy, it’s my new big thing. Onlinetherapyhub.co.uk will be launched next week.
Clay: Excellent.
Geoff: Again, I’ve got some guys. They are running it for me, the figure heads, they are real key figures. Philippa Weitz, Kate Dunn, Carol Francis-Smith, they are really key figures over here that got experience in this area. They talk a really good story. Kate has got a wonderful way of writing and there are a lot of issues around online therapy.
Clay: Let’s jump right in because it’s the Online Counselling Podcast. Tell us what people are going to be able to learn and what the Online Therapy Hub is going to bring to the table.
Geoff: Well, I think you have to go back to Mr. Hoover and a vacuum cleaner. What’s the difference between a Hoover and a vacuum cleaner? Well, Hoover has got great branding. Skype has done the same thing.
Clay: Right.
Geoff: But Skype is not recognized in this country to be used for online therapy.
Clay: So the same with us.
Geoff: Yeah because Microsoft as you know can collect that data and use it. If you ask anyone, what’s the word they use? “Well, I do Skype therapy.” Dare I say it, there’s even a directory called Skype Therapist’s Directory.
Clay: Yes, I saw that.
Geoff: I think he may have some difficulties going forward. I’m surprised Microsoft hasn’t discussed that with him in some form or fashion. There are a number of players. What we do on Online Therapy Hub is actually, I’ve had a therapist, in this case, Carol, actually test a number of alternative solutions to Skype and we’ve written reviews. These are actually reviews written by Carol who is a therapist who has used different kit and has written her frank reviews of all the kit that’s out there. We’ve also got a very neat table there which indicates what is good about it, what’s bad about it, what’s going to possibly have jurisdiction or difficulties.
Clay: Nice, so things like Vsee, Zoom, some kind of the iCam, you test drive them, Carol did, and written a review.
Geoff: Absolutely.
Clay: Oh nice. Okay.
Geoff: Yeah and let me be clear. I’m working with all these guys. We’re not trying to criticize them. Once we’ve done the reviews, and we did this with the practice management software. We do send it to the organizations in question. We ask for their honest opinion about our review. Have we missed anything? Is there anything else that we should say? Have we got something wrong? Now, they then come back and say, “Well, actually, there’s this, this, and this.” If we made a mistake genuinely, the therapist will add that to the report. If we don’t agree with that comment, we’ll put that down as a comment from the manufacturer or the software supplier. You are getting a very good report that has been well tested. It is not something that someone has just done in five minutes. We do take our time and trouble. Are you familiar with Which, Which Reviews? Okay. Which Reviews is a British based organization. I don’t know whether they were in the States or not, I do apologize. They do that with a whole range of stuff from washing machines, tumble dryers, you name it, anything domestic. They will do a report. They will send out people. They will test it. They will really go through it.
Clay: It sounds like our Consumer Reports. We have a consumer reports.
Geoff: Yeah. It is a commercial organization. They have money for doing this, but they are very well regarded, a very good brand image, and I hope that one day, we’ll be regarded in the same way because that’s what we’re trying to achieve.
Clay: Great. You’re also doing some education on there because there are some things to be considered with online counseling. Philippa Weitz, we just completed a podcast with her and her new book on Psychotherapy 2.0. What are some other things? Is it a blog going on at Online Therapy Hub? What are some other things that is coming forward soon?
Geoff: Philippa has done a very nice quiz?
Clay: A quiz?
Geoff: Yeah and it is something you should do because it actually tests you in terms of what you actually know, what don’t you know about online Therapy and delivering it.
Clay: Okay.
Geoff: Which I think is quite revealing actually. I mean, we’ll have news. We got the software reviews, the training, conferences, there’s a therapist Q&A which again we found very useful on Private Practice Hub that people do ask lots of questions and I’ll get the team to answer them. We actually can see what the sort of stream of activity is in terms of therapists, what their concerns are. If we get lots of questions around a specific theme, we’ll then start writing blogs about it.
Clay: Oh wow, that’s great. You’re being really responsive to what therapists are coming to you with their questions, whether it’s licensure, international boundaries, or web platforms. You go, “Okay, these are the questions. We’re going to respond to them.”
Geoff: Yeah. We’ve already done a lot of that, but there are things that we can come up with or we haven’t dealt with. This will give us an opportunity so much so, again, it won’t be there for the launch but hopefully by the end of next week, we’ll have a survey on there that a therapist can actually, and one of the questions I think on there is what’s missing? What else do you need to know? We’re giving everyone the opportunity to come and tell me, what are we missing because that again, going back to Private Practice Hub, that’s the thing that no one ever tells me. I get lots of therapists say, “Oh, fantastic. Thanks very much. Why is it free? What’s the catch?” but they don’t me, :What is on there?” That’s for a web developer, for a marketer, for someone trying to create a resource for people is the missing link. No one ever tells you what you don’t know.
Clay: The field is changing. We’re trying to catch up. We’re trying to here in the States, in the UK, really all over the world trying to adapt counseling, psychotherapy to an online world. As, sort of an outsider, you’re not a therapist yourself, are there things that you were fascinated or surprised to learn as you began to explore online therapy yourself?
Geoff: Well, one of the things that is what I mentioned to you some moments ago was about your eye contact. That really is quite important because if you have face to face contact with people, a therapist will tend to be looking at that individual for key signs, body movements, etc. However, what happens online therapy? Where’s the camera? You haven’t got control of where the camera is at your client’s end and the problem I think that’s going to happen is this lack of looking at someone. One of the things that Philippa is planning to do and we talked about is about where camera should be, the lighting, sound quality, just to give people an idea. You’re not used to doing online therapy, these are the things you need to know.
Clay: Just logistics.
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: Now, knowing that you’re working with Philippa….
Geoff: For instance, you can see behind me a chair. It wouldn’t be very good to have that in therapy especially when my cat usually sits on it.
Clay: It’s some of the logistics. It’s just different. There are some training and Philippa was saying that a lot of therapists are taking to online therapy saying, “I’ve’ been doing this for 20, 30, 40 years. This is nothing different. I don’t need any additional training. I’m just going to jump in. It’s like having a driver’s license to a car and now I’m going to start driving a truck or something, but it’s not. There has to be some considerations of some of the logistics. They are not a lot but there is some. I’m assuming, just let you say it out loud, that the Online Therapy Hub is going to be and is an advocate for additional training to allow therapists to do this better.
Geoff: Absolutely and in fact, we do have on our new sites, there is actually a training section with links to all the different training organizations.
Clay: Wow, excellent.
Geoff: I’m checking to make sure it’s on there.
Clay: Yes, it is. I saw that earlier. What is the popularity you think of online therapy in the UK?
Geoff: Well, that’s one of the reasons why I’m doing it is that this was a question that kept coming up time and time again on every Q & A that I did. I do get lots of emails about why you’re not doing anything about online therapy and hence the reason why I’ve done it as a separate section within the Private Practice Hub.
Clay: Okay. Wow, so this is going to be launched soon.
Geoff: Very soon.
Clay: An incredible resource.
Geoff: I’m going to show next week, Tuesday and Wednesday, and the TV channel and the Online Therapy Hub. I’ve told my team I want them launched by Tuesday, ready for the show.
Clay: Incredible, absolutely incredible.
Geoff: It will keep changing, especially the Online Therapy Hub. There are so many new innovations and so many things that are going to keep coming forward on that, and the TV Channel is going to keep changing because we’re going to keep having different ideas, but essentially, we’ve got to start somewhere and I’d rather start having it as a building block that you guys as therapists, you let us know what else you need on there, what else are we missing, and I will do it because I want to be the greatest resource for therapists, the go to place for all events, for anything around running a private practice.
Clay: Absolutely.
Geoff: My global aspirations will be, at the moment it’s UK focused but globally, I’m thinking about taking this around the world.
Clay: Okay. Pretty soon, it’s going to be a global taking over the world, Geoff Simons and the Private Practice Hub.
Geoff: How about Private Practice Hub Global?
Clay: Global, I love it. Well, there’s an absolute need, I think, and we talk about here in the US, we need information on how to run a business, how to do things appropriately. We’re so many of us out here on our own alone and to have a hub to go to and figure that out is incredibly valuable.
Geoff: We have to use that as an expression right at the beginning in that first paragraph about the arm around the shoulder because, again, in NHS world, so in the public world, you have colleagues. You have people to talk to. When you’re an individual therapist, you’re alone. You just have your clients to talk to.
Clay: Right.
Geoff: How does that work? Yeah, you go to training sessions and you might meet some people there. Generally, Katrina always found that people just pick her brains because she has a rather successful business and they just ask her questions. She doesn’t get any feedback about how more successful she could be or any help or assistance. There isn’t anything out there. Hopefully, Private Practice Hub does become the arm around the shoulder and now with the online activity, people will actually be able to talk to us directly and see us, because again, one of the things that we will have from time to time will be an open Q &A section because that’s what Katrina and I used to do at the association meetings.
We used to have Q &As. I used to ask her questions like you’re asking me questions and she would respond. She’s excellent at that. She doesn’t need a script. She’s so knows her business. I mean, it’s not unusual because most therapists aren’t trained in marketing, business, finance. She comes from a background where she wasn’t a trained therapist. She went into another career, as I said in Manhattan, and then she went to the University of New York and got her doctorate and put her shingle up over here.
Clay: Shingle up.
Geoff: You will get that one out eventually. That was that. Because she had a background that wasn’t wholly therapeutic, if you like, she has a sense about how to run a business.
Clay: I think both of you bringing incredible value from your backgrounds into this field. Going back to the Q & A, what if I threw a couple of questions to you? We’re talking a lot about the benefits of online counseling and I think we’re both an advocate that this going in this direction. What are some of the challenges that you’re seeing in the UK for therapists who are doing this online counseling? I think you’re aware here in the US, we’ve got the HIPAA Law, we’ve got border issues and licensures from state to state. What are some of the things that we may not be aware of or may not apply to us in the UK?
Geoff: It’s a good question. I’m not really sure how to respond to that because interestingly, I suppose the seed that this was, apart from getting the questions from the therapists and about the Q & As that I was doing, I also got an inquiry 4-5 months ago now from Ireland asking me, and now putting on my connect psychotherapy practice hat, said, “We’ve got all these guys over here that could do with some therapy, could you offer an online therapy service?” It does appear that there are not as many resources in Ireland as the amount of people requiring it.
There is an opportunity there. At that time, we were busy with many other things and I didn’t have time to tape that up, but that was interesting. That sort of bought me into the field of, well actually, there is definitely a market out there and if I can get these inquiries from Ireland, because one of the questions that I always get is, “I need to have some more referrals. They go up and they go down. What happens now? Should I do marketing?” and most therapists don’t do marketing and if they do, they do it when they need it, which is not the way to do it.
You should be doing marketing throughout the whole of the year on a constant basis so you can deal with the peaks and the drops. With online therapy, I don’t think we know what all the issues are going to be yet. Certainly, you’ve mentioned the two main ones which is jurisdictional and I don’t think it’s going to come out until the first legal case.
Clay: Yes. Philippa and I talked about this a bit that UK law is based on case law. It’s not really a written constitution. We have to have somebody get in trouble in the UK, is that what you’re saying?
Geoff: Yes.
Clay: And then that will be the result, but so far, no one has gotten into trouble for doing this work.
Geoff: This is why Skype is being used because no one is actually been hold out for the cause by any association saying, “That’s not really appropriate way of going forward.” Once it does, then that becomes the last new story and certainly, all the other software providers will jump on that, but I do think that the associations aren’t putting their head above the parapet and saying, “Hey guys, you shouldn’t be using that.” It’s an important thing to us with all the information that we have about what is the best way to deal with this.
Clay: There are a lot of alternatives out there on my side and on yours that are free or a small monthly fee to be able to do this just to be safe and actually, I found that the connection is so much better on Vsee, Zoom, or iCam. It’s better than Skype outside of the encrypted issue.
Geoff: Particularly if you were doing family therapy or you were doing it. You needed to have more than one screen.
Clay: Absolutely.
Geoff: Which is quite interesting again in terms of, yeah, that’s tricky I think for a therapist to actually have multiple screens.
Clay: It can be.
Geoff: And controlling that conversation. I think that’s definitely going to be happening in the family therapy world for sure.
Clay: Geoff, I can’t thank you enough. We kind of delved into some history here of private practice and what’s coming up new with Online Therapy Hub, all that you have going to be bringing to the table. There’s a lot of free information on the Online Therapy Hub for my listeners because people come here wanting to know about the online counseling world. Now, we’re learning a bit more about the UK. Any final thoughts as we wrap this up?
Geoff: Look, just to let your audience know, you mentioned the word iCam. Well, when my Online Therapy Hub gets launched next week, if they are quick and they are the first 20, they get the first six months for free.
Clay: Very nice, very nice. Alright, everybody listening, it launches next week, the onlinetherapyhub.co.uk and the first 20 people signing up is getting iCam for free for six months.
Geoff: Indeed. Just go on the review for iCam and click on it. Everything else will be revealed, but the first 20 are free and then as a deal if you’re not the first 20.
Clay: They still get something.
Geoff: They get a cheaper deal. I mean, that’s the idea that we’re trying to offer is a good deal for the members and I get a small commission. I am putting my hand up there that I do get something out of this.
Clay: Of course, good. You have to pay those servers and hosting fees.
Geoff: Absolutely, which I have more about the web development and every time I do something, it’s another few bucks.
Clay: I rarely speak with someone that is so cutting edge with television and online therapy, and all that you’ve been adding for a very long time with Private Practice Hub. I’m encouraging all my listeners, go over there, check out all this information. I go there all the time and learn something new every time I visit. Ladies and gentleman, thank you Geoff Simons for coming on.
Geoff: Well, I thoroughly enjoyed, loved talking to you. Best wishes to all of your audience and hopefully, they will come and speak to me at some point. Just email me. Cheers.
Clay: Good, have a great evening.
Geoff: Thanks very much indeed. Adieu. Bye now.